actually, seems as though i figured it out.. The answer was just more patience . I ended up using Maya's tools to make sure I had only 3 sided/4 sided faces..and then tweaking the results to fix whatever problems that caused Anyway, I think ive gotten the look that I want for the model of the cup so far. Makes me laugh, because no matter how hard i work on something, as soon as i post my problem on a forum I find a solution ..