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# 1 14-08-2004 , 02:22 AM
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AVP THREAD (CONTAINS SPOILERS!!!)

Ok, so I just came from seeing ALIENS VS. PREDATOR and I have to report with mixed feelings. Actually, more CONS to report than PROS.


PROS:
*The action was decent. Some good AvP action in a few scenes.

*The ALIEN effects were nice. If you're a fan of ALIENS, then you'll remember how stiff the queen was when she was fighting Ripley. In AvP she's all out natural! The final chase scene had me on edge.

*Some really nice bullet time shots of the face huggers leaping at their victims.

*The Preds were pretty kewl. While not as charismatic as in the PRED I & II movies, they were never-the-less Predators.

*Hopefully there will be a better director for AvP2. Oh yes, according to the end of the film, there "should" be a sequel. During the film a Pred is 'impregnated' by a face hugger and the chestburster makes its appearance at the end of the film. Which, if you know your ALIEN lore, ALIENS take on the form of their hosts. Can we say PRAETORIAN? user added image


Ok, now for the bad news...

CONS:
*Way too short. Registering in at 1hr 30min. there simply wasn't enough time for story build. Everything seemed like the science team knew what was going on. They 'discovered' things too quickly.

*For archeologists making a first discovery they sure weren't interested in much of their surroundings. Big huge statues of Predators outside the pyramid and they walked right past them without so much as a look.

*The action wasn't enough. There was more of the science team trying to escape the labrynth of the pyramid than there was of AvP action.

*Aliens were too "smart". While we know they possessed a 'hive mind' of some sort, they were way more intelligent than those from the ALIEN movies that were supposed to take place hundreds of years in the future.

*Not enough build on the Predator "young'ns". Showing the process of them getting ready for the hunt would have been nice.

*The Aliens, when walking, had the same exact motion as the Raptors from Jurassic Park. "Can we steal a little dino-motion from you Mr. Spielberg?"

*Not much emotion from the lead chick when she was about to become brain filleted by an Alien. Even after killing it she was more or less like, "Wow, that was close."

*Aliens incubated way too fast. In ALIEN, it took a few 'hours' for the chestburster to appear. In AvP, they spawned almost instantaneously. However, I guess Pred biology is different than humans. In one scene, it shows a chestburster coming out of a human almost as soon as the facehugger drops off while later, a Pred who is attacked by a face hugger doesn't fall victim to the chestburster until the end of the film. (btw - a lead in to AvP2) Well, for only being and hour and a half, I guess they had to work quickly.

I don't know. Since I just came from seeing the film I'm still trying to re-live it. I need a bit more time to remember what I did and didn't like about it. I know I listed a lot more CONs than PROs but all in all it wasn't really that bad of a movie. It fails in comparison to some of the AvP stuff I've read by Darkhorse, but it still kept me kind of entertained in the end. I knew the one year production time wasn't going to be enough for this film.

All I can say is go see it for yourself and then reply back here. (If you actually bothered to read thru this far without seeing the movie first.) user added image


Dave Baer
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Digital Media Arts College
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# 2 14-08-2004 , 03:18 PM
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OK, the action was good but the ending was one of the worst endings I have ever seen. No one thought this out? The preditor could see the alien in the other people but not himself? They are very noble. It the first one they would not shoot an unarmed person. They would do anything to stop the aliens from escaping but he would indanger everyone with on in his stomache? come on that was bad but even worse is the fact that the queen lost her ability to see or smell an infected animal? She stuck her sticker through him and chanced killing her last offspring? Paul anderson did a good job on the effects and the sound but in hi quest to keap the story alive he ruined it for me.

# 3 14-08-2004 , 03:33 PM
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Yup! There's one that I missed.

I'm assuming, and since there's so much story left out that's all I can do, that the PRED's have some method of removing the chestbursters, which is why he didn't seem too concerned about it. Probably figured "Well, when I get back on the ship I'll have it removed."

But my wife brought up a good point about that also. If the PREDs have the X-Ray vision mode and are able to see the CB's inside of hosts, then why didn't any of the PREDs at the end see it in their dead pal? user added image


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# 4 14-08-2004 , 03:42 PM
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I think the main reason they didn't see the alien in the pred was they where not wearing their helmets. I think the helmet is what gives them ablitly to see clearly things inside a person/thing..
I did see a few diffrent helmet options for scanning in the movie a green scan and then heat scan.

As well if the alien is cold blooded that would mess things up with out the helmet=).

I think I remeber in alien one the pred was not able to see nearly as clear with out his helmet on near the end of the movie.

Just my way of thinking....


I am enough of an artist to draw freely upon my imagination, knowledge is limited, imagination encircles the world. (Albert Einstein)

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# 5 14-08-2004 , 04:00 PM
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I did love the fight scene. You made a great point on the rip off of the raptors from Jurasic park. The whole draw your attension thing seemd very familiar. The combintion of CG and animatronics was awome. One more thing I did not understand. Is the blood in the head deferent than the blood in the fingers of the alien? Whey did the fingers burn everything but he was able to wear the head as a shield. They should have showed the predator clean it more. I am a huge fan of the series. One more thing that got me on the second predator and now this one was the siz of the predator. Do you remember how much larger the predator was than arnold. The predators lost about two feet of height. Arnold was suposed to be a huge guy and the predator towered over him. Everyone in this one was average height so they should have seemed that much smaller but they did not.

# 6 15-08-2004 , 01:05 PM
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I didnt realise they had realised this yet! Cool, so I'm glad you guys arent slating this completley user added image I still havent even seen it yet and it's not out over here till october!

Did you guys enjoy my hologram shots?! user added image (the ones with the pyramid as a wireframe in the predator ship) Man those were a nightmare to do!

I hope you stayed and watched the credits as well user added image

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# 7 15-08-2004 , 02:07 PM
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Yes Alan they where great... Im still jealouse... Do you have any openings for organic modelers muahhahahah...

I saw your name in the credits .....


I am enough of an artist to draw freely upon my imagination, knowledge is limited, imagination encircles the world. (Albert Einstein)

https://www.artstation.com/kurtb
# 8 15-08-2004 , 02:18 PM
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Hey Pure,

So those were the shots you worked on? They looked good! You just modeled them right? You didn't do any actual compsiting, did you?

I didn't stay for the credits, but if I had, I wouldn't have known who to look for anyway unles they credited Pure_Morning. user added image


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Digital Media Arts College
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# 9 15-08-2004 , 02:42 PM
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First of all, the ending of the movie doesnt lead to a sequel: Only the queen can breed so at worst the alien will be alone in a ship full of predator: good luck!

The 'bridge jumping' sceen was very badly done, it didnt look natural at all. They had a jumping angle of about 45' which is impossible for such a long jump.

I also think that more time should have been spent to add details: cleaning the alien head, realizing that the maze changes every 10min, etc.. Btw, the aztec calendar is a real joke, converting from gregorian calendar to aztec cant be donne that easly. They are not on the same base thanours and more importantly, they didnt use minutes for mesurements...

All in all, I think the movie was a 6,5-7 / 10. It could have been done much better by just adding more script and details scene. These kind of scene dont cost much and make the whole thing much more believable.

I really liked the cross-over with Bishop, it was a great idea.

Alan, your scene was very well done, good job.

Oh.. finaly critic: as a rock/ice climber, I would like to point out AGAIN that this movie show our sport in a total irrealistic way. The MI2 intro was more realistic.

# 10 15-08-2004 , 05:15 PM
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First of all, the ending of the movie doesnt lead to a sequel: Only the queen can breed so at worst the alien will be alone in a ship full of predator: good luck!

Aside from the past Aliens we've seen, AVP introduced the new breed known to the AvP game fans as the PRAETORIAN - an Alien/Predator crossbreed and a much stronger offspring than the normal Aliens we've all come to know and love. New breed, new ideas. A whole new Alien series can be made from just this one idea.

But wishful thinking aside, from someone who has a film studies background, if you're not going to make a sequel then don't show any 'extra' information at the end of the film. That chestburster at the end SCREAMS sequel.

Remember, both ALIEN and ALIEN Resurrection played off of a single ALIEN for the entire film. No Queen. Just because it's alone doesn't mean it can't wreak havoc... even for an hour and 30 minutes. user added image


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# 11 15-08-2004 , 05:33 PM
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That could be intersting having a movie that is void of humans. Somehow make the predators understandable and we would start to learn about them a bit. Not a bad idea, it is just the way they went about it was wrong. That would take a skilled director. I think Paul anderson is good at the action shots and sound editing. I really think he is weak at character developement and music score to add to the emotional impact. You never really feel for his characters. Not that I could do any better. One thing they could do with a sequal could be to introduce the alien race that owned the deralict space craft from alien and how they got hold of the alien.

Alan, I loved your shots. That was sweet when you see were the people were and then they actiivated the qween. The hologram looked real good. I am very partial to lighting effects to. Did you also do the one were they saw the humans get there weapons?

# 12 16-08-2004 , 01:59 AM
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Well, if they play it right, they could tie in all these movies to the very first ALIEN movie. Think about it... The sequel is - on their way back to their homeworld, the ALIEN causes havoc on the PRED ship, where they also happen to be carrying a Queen larva to transplant to another planet for hunting. The Queen escapes, lays her eggs and wipes out the Predators (oooh, sweet revenge!) with a whole troop of Praetorians which are stronger than the regular Drone Aliens. This works well with the next part because they need to be stronger in order to handle the size of the "Space Jockeys" who are somewhere around 12-15 feet tall.

The ship floats aimlessly through space until a salvage ship from some other alien race comes across it (i.e. - the space jockey from ALIEN). The Queen manages to climb aboard their ship during the salvage and makes a home deep in its hold. Lays her eggs again and wipes them out as well. The movie ends with the scene of 'the navigator' (space jockey) trying to land his ship only to succumb to the suffering of a chestburster - thus tying in to how that derelict spacecraft ended up on LV426 for Ripley and her crew to find.

Would be kind kewl to see that. user added image


Dave Baer
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# 13 16-08-2004 , 07:03 AM
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I cant believe we have to keep pumping out this trashy kind of film...ie: resident evil, doom, and A V P !

Why cant script writers come up with something original instead of dragging up utter garbage like this? Its a joke. Seems to me that all its about today is CG and anyone with half a brain wont be interested in just that alone

# 14 16-08-2004 , 09:19 AM
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Alan, I loved your shots. That was sweet when you see were the people were and then they actiivated the qween. The hologram looked real good. I am very partial to lighting effects to. Did you also do the one were they saw the humans get there weapons?

Yeah I had a hand in that, that shot was actually the last of our shots to be finalled (About 2 weeks ago!!!) I didnt do the compositing or the modelling it was the lighting and rendering that I did. My "big" annoying shot was one of the other hologram shots where the predator targeter aligns on the pyramid and then loads of predator text swims about on screen. Nightmare of a shot believe me!

Alan


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# 15 16-08-2004 , 01:06 PM
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He Kevin, I think you go a little hard on resident evil! This movie is awesomely done! The scenario might not be THAT great but the sound effects & music are top notch! As a matter of fact, I challenge you to find a movie with a better use of music & sound effects.

Also, its style of production is very neat and has a timeless feeling that make it a classic. And the zombies were among the best freaks I have seen (I also likes the one from Dawns of the deads who were much more dangerous).

Of course, there isnt much talk between the caracters but swat teams arent supposed to talk about their childhood while on mission.

Anyways, I just saythis to point out that originality doesnt always come from the script but from the way it is presented to the public.

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